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By mburkit
#4936368
namebrand wrote: June 27th, 2020, 6:14 am The relay was epoxied on directly. The grey seen on screen is the epoxy that’s still visible on the pedal now. If you compare the height of the ITT off the Hammond there’s no room for a socket to fit.
Thank you for your "Zoom and Enhance" skills, namebrand. Yeah, in your image, it does look like it is just a bad epoxy job.
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By westies14
#4936369
Ben, I think the black base of the Hammond also gives the relay a sort of "floating" illusion. If you look for that black base edge though, it doesn't appear so high off the box. Any part of a socket would lift the relay off to the point of a clear mismatch, but it also seems that the pins aren't cut quite flush with the base of the relay. Their short, stumpy remnants are lifting the relay up just a little bit. The remaining hole in the Hammond box is cut to fit the relay's post, but you can also see the fossils of the pins circling it:

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It's possible that leaving the pins a little less than flush was intentional rather than sloppy, with the idea of giving the epoxy something extra to bite onto rather than just the flat bottom of the relay. Still, the thick epoxy application is par for the course on the GB1 pedal. If you go back to the ballroom image that had you questioning the height, you'll see the same thick epoxy application at the bottom of the spring hose as you see under the relay. It's used pretty liberally at the top of that hose and on all four feet as well!
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By Kingpin
#4936372
Cheers Matt, John, Doug. I suppose that gives a bit of breathing room for people wanting to replicate the GB1 pedal but weren't having luck finding the socket.

That being said, I'm gonna see what mechanical options are available to fix that sucker down as after my N-Filter got knocked off years ago, I'm bolting down everything I can. :P
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By Coover5
#4936375
I feel so ready for Ghostbusters 3 to come out then a thread like this comes up and I'm schooled on my knowledge of GB1 and the equipment. There is still so much learning I have to do. I'm loving this.
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By westies14
#4936376
If anyone is having trouble finding bases, I think I have several of them. I’m pretty focused on the GB1 props and won’t ever use them.

I’m with you on the mount, Ben! I think just yesterday I was lobbying for a (possibly overkill) screw where we aren’t certain one way or another so it’d have that mechanical connection, and John asked me what exactly I’m planning to do with this pedal... I think something could be done with the relay’s post to lock it down from the inside. Maybe it could be drilled and tapped, then given a bolt and washers. Alternatively, though it wouldn’t be technically correct, perhaps a couple screws could come up from the box and into the relay’s base - they could be hidden by the epoxy.
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By Kingpin
#4936378
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westies14 wrote: June 27th, 2020, 7:54 amI think something could be done with the relay’s post to lock it down from the inside.
That's my feeling as well, something like the base of a bayonet fitting light bulb perhaps:

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-Maybe even work some kind of collar into the design.
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By Nuclearjungle
#4936380
I've been working on my own GB1 pedal and trap lately and hadn't come to attaching the relay yet. Yikes, I'm not sure I want to permanently glue the only RM833212 I have to that thing.

It's not entirely accurate, but perhaps I'll mount a socket so that the metal wings are underneath the surface of the project box. That way just a tiny bit of the socket will be visible, and it'll blend in with the relay base.
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By mburkit
#4936382
westies14 wrote: June 27th, 2020, 7:54 am I’m with you on the mount, Ben! I think just yesterday I was lobbying for a (possibly overkill) screw where we aren’t certain one way or another so it’d have that mechanical connection, and John asked me what exactly I’m planning to do with this pedal... I think something could be done with the relay’s post to lock it down from the inside. Maybe it could be drilled and tapped, then given a bolt and washers. Alternatively, though it wouldn’t be technically correct, perhaps a couple screws could come up from the box and into the relay’s base - they could be hidden by the epoxy.
On my first pedal in this thread, I attempted to drill and tap the post on the relay and the plastic was so brittle because of how old the relay is, that it snapped the post off the bottom of the relay. I ended up having to take the base off the relay and a bolt/washer/nut through the post to hold it to the bottom of the relay. I do think someone could easily drill and tap a hole perpendicular to the orientation of the post and use that as a way for extra security; I just wanted to comment about my experiences with it so people know to be more careful than I was, hahaha. This experience also highlights another issue, which is if you make the post too secure in the project box, you run the risk of just snapping the post off the relay. With just epoxy, maybe there is a chance the epoxy would give before the post, letting the relay remain whole if it gets knocked around/knocked off the pedal.
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By Prologic9
#4936396
Those center posts are always brittle on the relays, they have an almost ceramic quality to the plastic.

If you yank the pins out you've got all those holes to work with, I'm sure you could thread a couple of small zip ties through them.
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By westies14
#4936397
This could be an easy solve for some - I'd want to get a longer screw if I did this to maintain the aesthetic, but it'd hold. Two corners of the relays are pre-drilled and tapped, and the epoxy should hide the trick if they were to come up through the Hammond and into the relay:

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By mburkit
#4936437
Got my second pedal done. Just need to find some way to get my hands on a vinyl version of that white label that goes on the side!

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Unless new info comes out or I find more accurate greeblies for either pedal (such as the electronic components), these pedals are pretty much done!
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By Prologic9
#4936452
What model relay are you using?

I noticed the pin housing on the ITT relays are really thick, that's probably why it sits higher in the screenshots.

I've got a bunch of Omron mk3p5's, those and the recent shop relays are nearly flush with the base;

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By mburkit
#4936459
Prologic9 wrote: June 29th, 2020, 3:37 am What model relay are you using?

I noticed the pin housing on the ITT relays are really thick, that's probably why it sits higher in the screenshots.

I've got a bunch of Omron mk3p5's, those and the recent shop relays are nearly flush with the base;
Honestly, I couldn't tell you what relays I used. The one on my belt hanger pedal I have had since 2010. I think it's a little tall. The one on the pedal I finished yesterday I think is closer to being right, but once again, these are not the exact manufacturer and p/n from what we ID'ed off the gb2 pedals. I pulled these out of boxes at a surplus junkyard.
By Alex Newborn
#4936465
mburkit wrote: June 24th, 2020, 12:49 pm Lastly, the thing that I do want to replace is the label on the large box. I do not have the correct label on there now but I have not seen anyone make the one for the gb1 pedal. It sounds like this label was also on the ECU, so maybe at some point someone will sell a vinyl version of this? That would be awesome.


I did a homemade version of it a couple of summers ago. Just printed it onto adhesive backed paper and then laminated it with packing tape. If someone does a vinyl run, color me interested!

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I went with a hybridized conglomeration of details, but I confess I found myself highly enamored of some of the unique features of that pedal as seen in the Seattle MoPop. I even contacted a docent to take some additional pics of it, but because of the lighting and the glass of the display case, even her pics weren't much better than the ones found elsewhere in this thread. (And per their agreement with the person who loaned it, she couldn't change those parameters.)

I love the way you've constructed the pedal base. I will definitely be revisiting mine after seeing how this was done. I did add the resistor under the pedal, but I did not have the recessed groove for it.

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And I've got to replace my acorn nut with a bullet latch now, too! Luckily, I've got a second trap project going right now, so I can make improvements to my 'hero' and transfer some parts over to the 'stunt'.

Also, on the hinge itself, one of the reference pics I found-- possibly a GB2 trap?-- showed it having four evenly spaced 'cylinders', but I couldn't find a match at that width. Mine had three, which I dislike.

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Bart Thornton posted pics of a trap on Facebook with the four cylinders on its hinge. He told me he used a piano hinge and cut it down to the proper width.

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I ordered this one from McMaster-Carr but I haven't cut into it yet.

Alex
Last edited by Alex Newborn on June 29th, 2020, 10:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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By Prologic9
#4936479
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I think the key words for finding the right hinges was "butt weld." You need a hinge without mounting holes because they don't make a 2" hinge with the proper spacing.

I bought these last year; https://www.ebay.com/itm/5-pc-062-Steel ... 2749.l2649

They work fine, but you can get them in aluminum as well, I'm going to look for that next time.
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By westies14
#4936484
For what it’s worth, the pedal’s hinge had existing holes which the prop makers ignored. It’s actually cut right on a hole, on the right side. They drilled their own holes where they needed them for the pedal mount.
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By Alex Newborn
#4936501
mburkit wrote: June 20th, 2020, 9:33 pmImage


I'm looking at more possible parts for mine now, but I don't trust my color-blind eyes to gauge the online photos.

Did you use a blue Hammond box 1591BBU or the 1591ABU?

Alex
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By Alex Newborn
#4936505
Yes, but which of those two did he use?

I was attempting to find a blue one, and found two serial numbers. One seems very light, one seems darker, but it was two different websites, so with cameras and monitors being what they are, it's hard to be sure.

Alex
User avatar
By westies14
#4936506
Those two are both too small - you want 1591LBU.

If you’re not in a rush, later this summer we’ll have kits with accurate parts available for the GB1 pedal, Including vintage Hammond 1591LBUs (same specs, but subtle differences from a retired injection mold, and slotted screws).
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By countspatula
#4945333
mburkit wrote: June 28th, 2020, 8:14 pm Got my second pedal done. Just need to find some way to get my hands on a vinyl version of that white label that goes on the side!
Thank you for this excellent build log! It pointed out some stuff I had never noticed and it inspired me to update my pedal kit.

First, this may come in handy - Ken Chung & I just finished a set of trap/pedal labels with the GB1 pedal sticker - my shop link is in signature.

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Second, I noticed that the black d-sub on the original didn't have a hinge latch on the top. I went down the rabbit hole and spent many hours ordering many different plugs and I'm 99% I found THE one:

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Amphenol # 863093C09ALF

Great work!
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By westies14
#4945336
The amphenol D-sub is the right shape and size, but accuracy diehards out there may want to sit tight. The original with the correct markings and details isn’t produced anymore, but we have a pile of them (NOS, which match the GB1 prop right down to a tiny production defect on the connector) already sorted into the accurate pedal parts kits, and there should also be plenty left over past the kits which I’ll be happy to send to anyone who wants one. Just a few more pieces left to go before they’re ready...
By tobycj
#4945344
ImperialWalker wrote: January 31st, 2021, 5:28 am Excellent work!

Sorry to resurrect an older thread, but I am wondering where one might find that "bullet latch?"
Not certain if it was this exact model, but a couple of guys on Facebook (I think westies14 is one of them?) have done some amazing research on the pedal and suggested this latch matches what was used on the screen used pedals.
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By Nuclearjungle
#4945351
Countspatula, awesome find. I thought my own black d-sub findings were very close, but that definitely beats mine. I immediately ordered a couple.

Westies14, do you expect to ship your kits soon? I was intrigued by your description of it last year, but then I tried to assemble the correct components myself when I thought I needed to get the trap done by Halloween. It's still not finished though, and I'd love to incorporate your parts before I finish the trap build in the next few months *knocks on wood*.
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By westies14
#4945372
I thought we'd have had them together last summer! We did manage to get to the machine shop once, but 2020 was not a cooperative year... Things are going slowly still, but still going.
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By tobycj
#4945374
westies14 wrote: February 1st, 2021, 7:10 am I thought we'd have had them together last summer! We did manage to get to the machine shop once, but 2020 was not a cooperative year... Things are going slowly still, but still going.
Fingers crossed for a better 2021! I'm wondering how much I'll need to take my pedal apart to include your parts when you get them finished, that, or just build another pedal! :D
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By ImperialWalker
#4945376
tobycj wrote: January 31st, 2021, 4:26 pm Not certain if it was this exact model, but a couple of guys on Facebook (I think westies14 is one of them?) have done some amazing research on the pedal and suggested this latch matches what was used on the screen used pedals.
Thank you!

Seems you can order them from a few places. If you live in the USA the shipping is $7, however if you're a Canuck like myself, the shipping is... $103.00!! WTF? It seems you can order a case from the company at $350 or so. :/

So, that makes it a little out of my range.

If someone would be willing to do some in-depth measurements on them, I would be happy to 3D model one that we could all print and use. Other than that, unless someone is willing to order one and ship it to me using a reasonable rate, I suppose I'm stuck with the Acorn Nut, or guesstimating a 3D model.
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